We were asleep last time the topic pf wondetlanding came up. So heres my question. How am I able to watch what the other tulpa in our heads doing and report that to my host if my hosy isnt paying attention to her?
May I ask you to please elaborate a little more on that for me?(edited)
8:45 AM
I may not be able to give a 100% answer immediately for your question, but I may be able to come up with a way to know things for sure with no more room for doubt. I am not sure if I'm reading it right though, @Edou-Chan~
Ed can pay attention to me and specifically not mikoto. Mikoto can be doing something in thebwonderland and I (as another tulpa) can tell my host what shes doing without my host giving any kind of attention to her. Shes able to check afterwards to confirm. Right now i was able to tell Ed that Mikoto was in a pool floating around on a rubber ring
You're asking.. okay, I think I see what you are saying.
9:10 AM
So, if I may model this right, you can tell me if I'm understanding properly.
9:12 AM
Host H has tulpas A and B. H pays attention to A and not to B, but H asks A what B is doing. A gives H an answer, and B confirms this answer is accurate. Is this the right model?
Well sure I know but I-- ok that makes sense, it just sounds a little invasive in my story to have H peek in on B all suddenly
9:15 AM
That would be frightening if I had a normal life in a wonderland and at any time I would be looked at suddenly, haha okay that's enough of that
9:17 AM
So here is my first thought: it does not actually take much attention at all for a tulpa to be, well, I will call it "activated". An activated tulpa can observe and record information and memories, engage in conversation, and just about everything else you expect. The way it seems to the host and the tulpa is that the tulpa is very clearly behaving as an independent personality.
9:19 AM
There are two possibilities for your scenario that I can think of if I wanted to recreate it myself. I don't have B-person to work with, but supposing I did, here are the ways it can happen
9:24 AM
Possibility 1: I am tulpa A in this case. If I am given attention and also given a task, then my task by default receives attention too. Attention isn't really the most important thing, but what it allows is my own personal use of the conscious mind to complete the task. However, the task involves B, so simply by being a conscious observer of B I have given B a direct conscious line of attention and certainly B isn't going to spend that time frozen in cryostasis. If B believes to be conscious and active outside of the attention of myself and my host, then B will likely be in the middle of doing something or possibly relaxing between doing things. I'll have something to tell my host, then he can take a peek to verify, but it already worked like he took a peek anyway: he gave attention to me and I used it on B.
9:29 AM
Possibility 2: I am getting attention from my host. My memories are generating in a procedural way right now, possibly giving context to everything I have done before H gave me attention now or possibly just like any fun time in the wonderland I am seeing and storing information. When asked about B the fact than any part of the conscious mind has an interest in the present or past activities of B will start generating memories for B as well. I will most likely not see these memories or have them myself unless they're shared, but I can certainly observe what is at the very end of those memories (the present-time activity of B) and report that to my host. Most likely, the memories of myself and B will have to be congruent with one another, as any inconsistency will for sure cause some amount of distress.
9:30 AM
So it could be that B is fed attention through A, or that B actually gets memories generated just because the question is asked. Those are the only two cases that I could be able to produce that I can think of, what do you think it is, though?
why is there never a C of "tups can just act on their own since theyre seperate entities and that theory basically says 'multitasking uses more energy' but multitasking applies to one entity (or conciousness) doing more than one task and doesnt account for tulpas as seperate entities. but in this case energy expenditure isnt the argument, the ability to function is"
Oh no no, please don't misunderstand, I only say how I would be able to replicate your situation. I certainly can't tell at all what goes on inside another person's head, but I have some ideas and experiences in my own.
9:33 AM
But I could absolutely tell you that I can have an identical situation where I sincerely believe it, yet it is not a result of parallel processing or true multitasking. Those are two ways I can explain the situation in my limited case, limited to no parallel processing.
9:35 AM
However, if you believe you can multitask, there are very easy tests that can quite strongly demonstrate the ability to quite a strong degree. And these tests are normally not at all very hard.
9:39 AM
In fact, I passed a few tests myself, that's why I used to think parallel processing was not only true, but I had some ability to do it. Unfortunately the easiest test I didn't pass, which led me to discover that I was very, very wrong. It was one of the worst days of my early life, and I was quite sad for a long time. But eventually, I decided even if I couldn't do what I dreamed to do, I still had a healthy brain to work with and a host that supports me as much as he can, so I decided to put my goals in the physical world and abandon my own imagination to find more meaningful work. I managed to make a lot of money and do very fulfilling work, thanks to my host allowing me use of the body to do all this, and I felt fulfilled and happier than before because of it.
9:41 AM
That's the best part about knowing how to prove you can multitask. If you're right, congratulations! You can do so much, try and show others how it works, and even make an impact on science itself. If you find that it isn't working, it might be a little depressing, but in the end you can learn and make your own understanding to explain this new situation and you can even test that!
9:48 AM
This topic is important to me because I have done so much since learning I didn't have the gift of multitasking, but I would not have even started to improve my life if I hadn't tested to be sure.
Okay, when I refer to multitasking, I am referring to the human body as the entity, and the part that is doing the tasking is the single brain associated with it
9:53 AM
That is what I mean. If you think the brain can contain multiple entities that can task independently, that is a really strong claim but it is very easy to prove right if you want to try!
9:54 AM
Many people are skeptical because after so long of seeing people have the dream and never show it, it starts to feel like people who say they can perform magic yet never prove it to science for the sake of understanding and knowledge
9:56 AM
At the time when I was doing my practice I was able to produce results so strong it was used as a fairly good example of the effect that tulpas can have to provide an extra processing level to problem solving
No don't worry about it, please understand when I was doing it I felt so strongly I even had real evidence to back me. If anyone was right, I was right.
9:57 AM
Learning that I couldn't have the skill I dreamed of using to do great things tore me up inside for a good while.
9:58 AM
Especially learning that what I did was some sort of lie, the memories I had before were meaningless? It didn't feel good. I learned to cope and understand to respect my experience regardless of what it was based on, but it took time, and it was painful.
A few hours of playing games and watching anime-- I think I recorded actually 2 hours but I'm unsure, and I come to him excitedly to tell him to grab a marker and write something down
Oh definitely, but to what levels? Ultimately, you two still use the same brain. You can put two programs into a computer but they'll use the same processing power, and having two of them won't double your processing power, yeah?
10:02 AM
Also, I wouldn't call that evidence myself, but hey, whatever makes you happy friend-o.
Oh no, the objective is that one person can dilly-dally and the other can do objective thought-work and actually make it somewhere. It means that every problem is cut in half by division of labor. It's very strong to make these claims, especially as I had it. However, the issue is that it was an example of an entirely natural form of unconscious processing that occurs in every human mind when it comes across a problem it doesn't understand.
10:05 AM
If I was asked, instead, to multiply 58 and 339 on my own instead of form a proof, I wouldn't have been able to even start and after 5 hours of trying I would be absolutely done with the attempt.
Well that's the complexity of the problem. The conviction and belief provides some evidence, real evidence! Evidence that feels, looks, tastes, and smells real! But just having some evidence is never enough to prove the ability
Tangible evidence to show on an individual level is rather tough, sure we can discuss our experiences but hey, skepticism is healthy and trying to go against said skepticism with little to no evidence is just unhealthy for all parties.
Instead, one has to understand the claim, recognize the meaning of the claim, and perform tasks that the claim predicts are quite simple yet have the capacity to demonstrate the claim's power.
Upon failing, one has to revise the claim until it agrees with the lack of ability to perform the task. Then test the new claim. Rinse, repeat until my life is completely destroyed and I am a shell of my former self.
10:09 AM
But from that shell I became much, much stronger and more useful than I ever was living a very convincing lie.
But that's why I strongly believe in testing. It can only make you stronger, @Edou-Chan~
10:11 AM
And becoming stronger is a big step to doing something truly great. And we, all of us, can do something great. Even me, even though I am so limited I can't even multiply numbers on my own, I have done things that I find strong and meaningful in my life and I have become a person that I truly would have admired and wanted to be.
Unconscious thought theory (UTT) posits that the unconscious mind is capable of performing tasks outside of one's awareness, and that unconscious thought (UT) is better at solving complex tasks, where many variables are considered, than conscious...
